A vigilant real estate agent in New York state has concluded what seemed like a never ending quest to make certain her seller could not be accused of colluding to defraud a lender in a FHA mortgage transaction. Facts...the seller assist in the contract exceeded FHA guidelines. This was not noticed until underwriting and the parties were never notified except via the closing instructions which arrived - as usual - at the last moment prior to closing.
The lender CAPPED the seller assist.
When this happens a GOOD title agent will contact all parties and explain prior to closing. This gives parties a chance to decide if they want to close or postpone and renegotiate the contract.
In this case the parties were not working with a GOOD title agent. They were working with a BAD title agent who chose instead to make the HUD-1 meet the lender and FHA instructions but to adjust the actual checks to reflect the terms of the sales contract.
DOESN'T ANYBODY READ? THIS IS A CRIMINIAL ACT. THE HUD-1 ADDENDUM THAT EVERYONE SIGNED CLEARLY COVERS MONIES MOVING OFF THE HUD-1.
The seller had not attended closing and neither had the real estate agent. The seller was represented by an attorney who saw no problem with this arrangement. Once the real estate agent realized what had happened, she recognized the fraud and the potential for criminal penalties and called everyone including the attorney, lender and title agent and everyone thought she was a nut. So, she called me.
It took her some doing but she has fully documented her efforts to rectify the transaction and it was the mortgage lender who - though they will not acknowledge the wrong doing of anybody - decided to send the seller the balance of proceeds so that the seller has in hand the full amounts reflected on the HUD. So, she covered her client and she is stopping there.
What bugs me about this case is that none of the professionals except this vigilant agent can see the fraud. Geez, how can they be so out to lunch?
A forensic audit of this file would have held all parties accountable for the fraud. I commend this agent. She was spot on with her assessment of the wrong doing and as for the other so-called professionals in the transaction, the seller's attorney, the title agent, the mortgage broker, the mortgage lender AND the layman, the buyer - all of whom should be capable of reading the HUD-1 Addendum..........brainless or willful frauds all.
Friday, September 25, 2009
So many interesting cases
...have crossed my desk lately that I should be blogging about but the good news is that we've been really busy and each time I think I should stop and post, I think about that next consumer waiting for their title work. So with that in mind I'm going to toss up these few notes without expanding into a larger post. Forgive me. ;)
- When building a new house or addition to an existing dwelling, hire a surveyor to come out, locate and mark the placement of the foundation BEFORE the builder breaks ground. One of our recent insured consumers had her property surveyed prior to the start of construction on a major addition. She failed to have the surveyor mark a location for the foundation. She allowed the builder to mark off and measure. Result? The addition is two inches over the lot line and the neighbor - who warned her she was close or over the line when he saw the construction - will not give an easement for less than a few thousand dollars.
Monday, September 14, 2009
Friday, September 11, 2009
protecting privacy
I thought we had this problem licked but just today we noticed a mortgage with a social security number on the first page. This is a government program and now we are wondering if this is a new development or just the first time it popped out to our eyes.
Why in heavens name would a mortgage lender or a government agency put a person's social security number on a document intended for public recording?
We have a call in to the lender to find out if we can remove the number prior to recordation.
Yoi.
Why in heavens name would a mortgage lender or a government agency put a person's social security number on a document intended for public recording?
We have a call in to the lender to find out if we can remove the number prior to recordation.
Yoi.
Wednesday, September 09, 2009
ALTA licensing fee
If you write title insurance using an ALTA form, heads up. ALTA has decided to claim ownership of the forms and charge a licensing fee.
WASHINGTON--(Business Wire)--
In a move aimed at strengthening the land title industry by protecting the
association`s top industry product, the American Land Title Association has
launched an initiative to license the use of its uniform title insurance policy
forms.
"ALTA`s uniform policy forms have become the `gold standard` throughout the
lending and legal communities. Because land title insurance coverage is
standardized, the secondary market readily accepts mortgages that carry title
insurance. This has greatly contributed to the growth of demand for title
insurance across the country," said Mike Pryor, president of ALTA.
Read more here on Reuters.
Wednesday, September 02, 2009
file this under WOW
Media reports and court records reveal that on August 24, 2009 a complaint was filed in the US District Court in Orlando by the Secret Service which alleges that Victor Cedeno had stolen over $1.5 million dollars from the proceeds of short sales he managed on behalf of his former employer Taylor, Bean and Whitaker (TBW). Read more on the Mortgage and Real Estate Fraud blog.
Monday, August 31, 2009
Thursday, August 27, 2009
so who gets to fix it?
Old unsatisfied mortgages, especially those with private individuals, drive me batty. On the one hand, if lots of time has passed and no foreclosure has taken place, some underwriters will instruct agents to simply insure over it. I've done that and been burned, not because of collection efforts by the mortgagee, but because the next attorney or title agent in the chain decides they want it fixed and won't take indemnification. That leaves me holding the bag. So I made a decision moving forward that I would insure over an old unsatisfied mortgage in the loan policy only. Owners have to take the exception. Interestingly, most owners don't want to take the exception. They don't want to get stuck with a fix either, so we either postpone for a fix or escrow.
I was called today by an attorney hired by a seller whose funds we are holding pending satisfaction of an old unsatisfied mortgage. The mortgagee was an individual now deceased. The attorney is having trouble with an heir and so chatted with First American - not the underwriter on this file - and they said they'd just insure over it. He wants to know if I'll rethink my position and insure over it.
Excuse me while I laugh.
Does he really think I'll buy into that proposal?
I was called today by an attorney hired by a seller whose funds we are holding pending satisfaction of an old unsatisfied mortgage. The mortgagee was an individual now deceased. The attorney is having trouble with an heir and so chatted with First American - not the underwriter on this file - and they said they'd just insure over it. He wants to know if I'll rethink my position and insure over it.
Excuse me while I laugh.
Does he really think I'll buy into that proposal?
Monday, August 24, 2009
Thursday, August 20, 2009
this web site should be taken down
TITLE PARTNERS PLUS
It's no longer in business. Despite their claims that they were RESPA compliant, they weren't. The entire illegal operation has been shut down by the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania and the FBI.
Why is this web site still sitting up there in the cloud making unsuspecting surfers confused? Their claims are bogus but some people believe everything they read.
Let's stop the kickback cycle. It stops one step at a time. Who do we need to talk with to get this kickback promising calculator off the net?
It's no longer in business. Despite their claims that they were RESPA compliant, they weren't. The entire illegal operation has been shut down by the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania and the FBI.
Why is this web site still sitting up there in the cloud making unsuspecting surfers confused? Their claims are bogus but some people believe everything they read.
Let's stop the kickback cycle. It stops one step at a time. Who do we need to talk with to get this kickback promising calculator off the net?
Friday, August 14, 2009
I'm still here and they are not.
It seems like a thousand years ago when I started this blog in 2006 and the sister blog, Radical Title Talk. Part of the impetus to defend good practices in title insurance was my outrage over an outfit in State College, Pennsylvania who was soliciting mortgage lenders for a big sham operation. I couldn't believe that someone would so openly operate outside of state and federal rules.
Well, read this article. I think it's all finally over. Their operations were shut down by the state and federal government last year or perhaps the year before. Now a major player in the operation pleads guilty to embezzling 1.6 million dollars from the escrow account.
Gee, I guess scofflaws can't be trusted. Duh.
We along with other good and reputable title agents are spending our time, one transaction at a time, sweeping up the mess left behind by these and other crooks who played at the title insurance game for a few years and are now, hopefully, out on their asses.
We will slowly help consumers rectify the errors and right the wrongs as we find them. We won't be paid extra to do it. That's part of what a title insurance premium pays for, the finding and correction of title defects. It's all part of the job.
I'm glad I'm still here and they are not.
I'm glad you are still here because if you are reading this, you're probably part of the good, so hello, good guys. We're still here. ;)
Well, read this article. I think it's all finally over. Their operations were shut down by the state and federal government last year or perhaps the year before. Now a major player in the operation pleads guilty to embezzling 1.6 million dollars from the escrow account.
Gee, I guess scofflaws can't be trusted. Duh.
We along with other good and reputable title agents are spending our time, one transaction at a time, sweeping up the mess left behind by these and other crooks who played at the title insurance game for a few years and are now, hopefully, out on their asses.
We will slowly help consumers rectify the errors and right the wrongs as we find them. We won't be paid extra to do it. That's part of what a title insurance premium pays for, the finding and correction of title defects. It's all part of the job.
I'm glad I'm still here and they are not.
I'm glad you are still here because if you are reading this, you're probably part of the good, so hello, good guys. We're still here. ;)
Monday, August 10, 2009
oh the drama of defalcation...
"Anytime you're talking about $10 million, you're not talking about a drop in the bucket. It's a major defalcation," said Larry Saichek, the court-appointed receiver in charge of Flagler's case.
Flagler Title's underwriters already have paid about $5 million in claims. Other claims still are being investigated, while a few have been denied. These claims are from people who had deposit money held by Flagler or people who were supposed to have mortgages paid by Flagler. Also making claims are real estate agents owed commission checks on sales.
And where in the world is Roger Gamblin? "Hell if I know," Saichek said.
None of the lawyers contacted said they know where he is.
Read more in the Palm Beach Post.
Flagler Title's underwriters already have paid about $5 million in claims. Other claims still are being investigated, while a few have been denied. These claims are from people who had deposit money held by Flagler or people who were supposed to have mortgages paid by Flagler. Also making claims are real estate agents owed commission checks on sales.
And where in the world is Roger Gamblin? "Hell if I know," Saichek said.
None of the lawyers contacted said they know where he is.
Read more in the Palm Beach Post.
Sunday, August 02, 2009
mortgage underwriting????
I guess since we have standards again, folks are experiencing real mortgage underwriting - perhaps for the first time. That's good but it sure is generating questions. I've had numerous e-mails over the past few weeks and decided to post answers to a few questions here.
In my pre-title life, I was a mortgage underwriter - FHA direct endorsement, VA automatic approval and FNMA/FHLMC. I had the pleasure of managing a couple of high volume retail/wholesale underwriting departments, so when you ask "What happens in mortgage underwriting?", I'll use my experience to answer that question. I say that because the automated pre-underwriting takes place earlier in the transaction and so when your file "goes to underwriting" it's going to a human being.
The biggest question on everyone's mind is how long will it take?
The actual file review will take about an hour if your case is fairly straight forward and the underwriter has the experience to make decisions on the risks identified in your circumstance.
Most of the time lost "in underwriting" is waiting for your turn at the decision table. When I managed underwriting departments our goal was always to get a file in and out inside of 24 hours. In high volume situations we shot for 48 hours, but the reality is that sometimes the flow of files due to rate fluctuations can be overwhelming and the wait can be days.
Why? Well, human underwriters are highly trained individuals and there aren't many of them, especially these days. Mortgage lenders are recreating and retraining underwriting teams.
So, are there any tips on how to make the process work for you - maybe make your file go through a bit faster? Your job as a borrower is to first have patience. Secondly, provide as much clear concise documentation as you can to demonstrate you have assets, stable income and a credit profile that demonstrates a willingness to repay the debt.
If you fight with your loan officer and complain about having to provide information, your loan officer might be forced to send your file into underwriting without sufficient data to convince the underwriter that you are a good risk or that your circumstances meet the guidelines of the program. So, your file will wait it's turn only to go into suspense or worst yet, be rejected. If that happens, you end up having to provide the data then go back into a waiting line again.
So, be your own best friend, realize that the mortgage underwriting guidelines - while they may seem onerous - are there for a reason - one that you may not understand, however, if you need a mortgage, you've got to play the game. Be honest but be thorough. Help your mortgage lender find in your financial profile a willing and able borrower.
If you can't do that honestly, then wait until you can. Fudging the data is fraud and criminal. If you cannot yet demonstrate stability of income or a willingness to repay debt, then start now and create your new financial future by being a more conservative manager of your money. After a year or two of a new financial profile, you should be able to get through the underwriting process successfully.
Hope that helps and good luck. ;)
In my pre-title life, I was a mortgage underwriter - FHA direct endorsement, VA automatic approval and FNMA/FHLMC. I had the pleasure of managing a couple of high volume retail/wholesale underwriting departments, so when you ask "What happens in mortgage underwriting?", I'll use my experience to answer that question. I say that because the automated pre-underwriting takes place earlier in the transaction and so when your file "goes to underwriting" it's going to a human being.
The biggest question on everyone's mind is how long will it take?
The actual file review will take about an hour if your case is fairly straight forward and the underwriter has the experience to make decisions on the risks identified in your circumstance.
Most of the time lost "in underwriting" is waiting for your turn at the decision table. When I managed underwriting departments our goal was always to get a file in and out inside of 24 hours. In high volume situations we shot for 48 hours, but the reality is that sometimes the flow of files due to rate fluctuations can be overwhelming and the wait can be days.
Why? Well, human underwriters are highly trained individuals and there aren't many of them, especially these days. Mortgage lenders are recreating and retraining underwriting teams.
So, are there any tips on how to make the process work for you - maybe make your file go through a bit faster? Your job as a borrower is to first have patience. Secondly, provide as much clear concise documentation as you can to demonstrate you have assets, stable income and a credit profile that demonstrates a willingness to repay the debt.
If you fight with your loan officer and complain about having to provide information, your loan officer might be forced to send your file into underwriting without sufficient data to convince the underwriter that you are a good risk or that your circumstances meet the guidelines of the program. So, your file will wait it's turn only to go into suspense or worst yet, be rejected. If that happens, you end up having to provide the data then go back into a waiting line again.
So, be your own best friend, realize that the mortgage underwriting guidelines - while they may seem onerous - are there for a reason - one that you may not understand, however, if you need a mortgage, you've got to play the game. Be honest but be thorough. Help your mortgage lender find in your financial profile a willing and able borrower.
If you can't do that honestly, then wait until you can. Fudging the data is fraud and criminal. If you cannot yet demonstrate stability of income or a willingness to repay debt, then start now and create your new financial future by being a more conservative manager of your money. After a year or two of a new financial profile, you should be able to get through the underwriting process successfully.
Hope that helps and good luck. ;)
Thursday, July 30, 2009
You need to watch this video.
Lessons to take away from it:
Always read your title insurance commitment prior to closing.
Always buy a professional survey prior to closing.
This homebuyer did neither. Buying real estate is a major purchase and a consumer must participate with a thinking cap on.
When you shop for your title insurance and settlement services, confirm that you will have a title insurance commitment for your review prior to closing. That's critical, because most title agencies send the copy to your lender and presume they will forward it to you. That rarely happens. At The Closing Specialists, we recommend in writing that you buy a survey and we have you sign a hold harmless if you choose not to. We mail a copy of the title insurance commitment and ask that you review it prior to closing.
Never - ever - rely upon visual cues for lot lines. Hedges and mowing lines are not reliable indicators.
Why does title insurance not cover items that would be discovered by a survey? Because without a survey in hand, title insurers would be taking on unknown risk. You have to purchase a survey to have that knowledge. Most people don't want to spend the money, but as you can see, buying real estate without a survey is very risky. This consumer should not be blaming title insurance. He should have been a more prudent consumer.
If you are reading this blog post, I know YOU are a prudent consumer, so stay cautious and do it the right way, eh?
Wednesday, July 29, 2009
BTW - I loved reading the comments by PA AG Tom Corbett.
I think our AG folks here in PA have their heads around the issue. He gets it. The only weakness in the thought process, in my opinion, is that I still do not think they understand the real defalcation picture. Perhaps our industry has swallowed the problem and it's not easily seen by the public. That's a big bank of losses and Mr. Lipshultz was serious when he implied that competition might cause theft. I know it sounds ridiculous on the face of it, but those of us in the business know it's the truth and that's why we need audit standards and oversight. Keep them honest. There's just way too much money flowing through unwatched.
Tuesday, July 28, 2009
Monday, July 27, 2009
new Closing Services Letter approved for PA...cost $75
The PA Department of Insurance has approved the amended rate filing submitted by TIRBOP.
TIRBOP withdrew it's request for a premium overhaul following pressure by the office of the Attorney General.
So, the only change is to the CSL which extends coverage to buyers and lessees. Effective 9-14-09.
TIRBOP withdrew it's request for a premium overhaul following pressure by the office of the Attorney General.
So, the only change is to the CSL which extends coverage to buyers and lessees. Effective 9-14-09.
Thursday, July 23, 2009
this is an interesting article
Here's a blurb: RISMEDIA, July 23, 2009-I have read at least a hundred articles over the last several years regarding the profitability of the typical brick and mortar real estate office business model. Having owned an independent real estate company with the brick and mortar business model in California years ago, and then, up until 3 ½ years ago, owning six Prudential franchises with 200 Realtors, I think I can speak to this issue with some authority.
Tuesday, July 21, 2009
The Wall Street Journal on title insurance....
The U.S. title-insurance industry faces increasing pressure from regulators to justify the fees charged to consumers for ensuring they have clear ownership of their homes.
For most people, title insurance is just another mysterious fee they must pay when they buy a home or refinance a mortgage. Unlike some of those fees, though, title charges aren’t negligible. They range from several hundred to several thousand dollars—and last year totaled more than $10 billion for the title industry. Lenders insist on the insurance to protect them against the possibility that a taxing authority, another creditor or a disgruntled heir may have a claim to the property, among other risks.
Friday, July 17, 2009
Monday, July 13, 2009
guess the fox made it into the hen house
Fascinating choice by the Obama administration.
David H. Stevens was the past President & COO of Long & Foster Realtors; Vice President of Mortgage, Title, and Insurance Division for Longer & Foster; Executive Vice President for Wells Fargo Home Mortgage; on the Lender's Advisory Council for the Mortgage Bankers Association (MBA); on the Board of Directors of the National Association of Mortgage Brokers (NAMB); on the Board of Directors of the Real Estate Services Providers Council (RESPRO).
Read more...
David H. Stevens was the past President & COO of Long & Foster Realtors; Vice President of Mortgage, Title, and Insurance Division for Longer & Foster; Executive Vice President for Wells Fargo Home Mortgage; on the Lender's Advisory Council for the Mortgage Bankers Association (MBA); on the Board of Directors of the National Association of Mortgage Brokers (NAMB); on the Board of Directors of the Real Estate Services Providers Council (RESPRO).
Read more...
Friday, July 10, 2009
query: can you request a reissue rate on a foreclosed home?
Sure can. The rules may differ in other states but in PA, if that foreclosed mortgage was dated within the last ten years, you're entitled to the reissue rate.
Monday, July 06, 2009
June 6, 2009
Commissioner Joel Ario
Pennsylvania Insurance Department
1326 Strawberry Square
Harrisburg, PA 17120 RE: final comment on public hearing for title insurance
Dear Commissioner Ario:
The give and take in the public hearing on title insurance was insightful and certainly raised some ideas that were outside of the box for me. Thank you for creating the thoughtful forum and shaking things up a bit in our creaky old industry.
DEREGULATING THE TITLE AGENT PORTION OF THE TITLE INSURANCE PREMIUM: It is clear to me that maintaining fixed pricing of title premiums has not helped to foster better quality in product or service. I don’t think breaking down that wall of price regulation will make much of a difference in quality. We have lots of crappy title agents with high prices so we might have lots of crappy title agents with low prices. On the other hand, if prices come down through competition, maybe some of the crappy operators who are only there for the big bucks will find some other easy money scheme and get the heck our of our once honorable profession.
SET AUDIT STANDARDS AND REQUIRE TITLE AGENTS TO HAVE AN ANNUAL CPA AUDIT: I believe we can achieve better quality in product and service by stiffening oversight of licensees. Key oversight has got to be escrow account related. This is where defalcations take place and is one of the largest sources of claims for title companies. An annual audit, perhaps similar to that performed for FHA mortgage lenders which looks at more than simply the financial records but also tests a random selection of files for adherence to regulatory guidelines, paid for by licensees, would help separate those who are serious title insurance professionals from those who are in the business for a fast easy buck.
CONSUMER DISCLOSURE: Teaming with other licensed persons in a position to make title insurance referrals, such as licensed real estate brokers and licensed mortgage lenders, so that consumers receive good disclosure BEFORE their title insurance order has been processed would help break up title agency steering relationships.
ANCILLARY FEES: Consumers are most confused when shopping by the ancillary fees charged by one title insurance agent versus another. The difference can be hundreds of dollars on the same transaction but if the consumer doesn’t know to ask for a thorough quote, they will make their shopping decision without having full disclosure of costs. Whether or not you move to deregulate the title agent portion of the premium, I believe we need a better way of helping consumers shop and consider these ancillary costs.
NOTARY SIGNING AGENT/INDEPENDENT CLOSER: I see the notary signing agent as sort of like an untested or unlicensed dental hygienist who is out there working on the public but not under the supervision of a dentist. I don’t know anything about dentist operations but as a consumer of dental services I presume a dental hygienist is tested or licensed and works under the supervision of a dentist. I have to think consumers of title insurance services make the same presumption about a closer who comes to their home and handles their very private information and very important transaction. The fact is that we presently have no official standards for closers in a title insurance transaction. I’d like to see the department require that closers in a title insurance transaction be either licensed title agents or employees of a licensed agent.
Should you have a question or concern, please feel free to contact me.
Sincerely,
Diane Cipa
General Manager
THE CLOSING SPECIALISTS
204 West Main Street, Ligonier, PA 15658
888-680-5177 x104
www.tcsclosing.com
724-238-7830 fax
TIRBOP revises rate filing
They have withdrawn their request to change the rate premium structure. They are still seeking approval of a new CSL including an increase in the CSL fee from $35 to $75.
Amended Rate Filing
Original Rate filing
Here's my comment to the PA Dept. of Insurance concerning the amended rate filing:
I'd like to offer these comments concerning the request by TIRBOP to increase the CSL fee to $75 and extend coverage to consumers.
Let's give consumers a choice.
We know mortgage lenders will require a CSL, most do. Do purchasers need or desire the type of coverage offered in the CSL? Perhaps. Should a purchaser in a mortgage transaction be forced to pay for the coverage if they do not want it?
I would think the purchaser most at risk of financial loss in a defalcation is the purchaser buying property without a mortgage, paying cash. If there is value in the extra coverage offered in the CSL, will it be available to cash purchasers and should they be forced to pay for lender coverage?
In addition, there are two other parties who suffer when a title agent goes south with the money, and that's the seller and a borrower in a refinance. I realize that neither of those parties are purchasing a title insurance policy and perhaps for that reason the coverages offered under a CSL cannot be extended to them for a fee.
From a title agent point of view, this new CSL isn't going to impact me directly. As a professional who tries to keep the interest of the consumer in the radar of decisionmakers, I think the underlying question is really what causes losses covered by the CSL and how best to prevent these losses so that our title companies remain solvent an the public isn't damaged.
I continue to be a proponent of annual independent CPA audits of title agents. Raising the bar of quality in our licensing and regulatory process will do more to fix our solvency problems and uncovered consumer/lender losses than just tossing money in the CSL bin.
I know there are some in the industry who will argue that consumers do not understand the risks and therefore will not understand that they need this coverage. I tend to trust consumers to make their own decision about how they want to spend their hard earned dollars provided they have been given sufficient data and a chance to think.
Sincerely,
Diane Cipa
Amended Rate Filing
Original Rate filing
Here's my comment to the PA Dept. of Insurance concerning the amended rate filing:
I'd like to offer these comments concerning the request by TIRBOP to increase the CSL fee to $75 and extend coverage to consumers.
Let's give consumers a choice.
We know mortgage lenders will require a CSL, most do. Do purchasers need or desire the type of coverage offered in the CSL? Perhaps. Should a purchaser in a mortgage transaction be forced to pay for the coverage if they do not want it?
I would think the purchaser most at risk of financial loss in a defalcation is the purchaser buying property without a mortgage, paying cash. If there is value in the extra coverage offered in the CSL, will it be available to cash purchasers and should they be forced to pay for lender coverage?
In addition, there are two other parties who suffer when a title agent goes south with the money, and that's the seller and a borrower in a refinance. I realize that neither of those parties are purchasing a title insurance policy and perhaps for that reason the coverages offered under a CSL cannot be extended to them for a fee.
From a title agent point of view, this new CSL isn't going to impact me directly. As a professional who tries to keep the interest of the consumer in the radar of decisionmakers, I think the underlying question is really what causes losses covered by the CSL and how best to prevent these losses so that our title companies remain solvent an the public isn't damaged.
I continue to be a proponent of annual independent CPA audits of title agents. Raising the bar of quality in our licensing and regulatory process will do more to fix our solvency problems and uncovered consumer/lender losses than just tossing money in the CSL bin.
I know there are some in the industry who will argue that consumers do not understand the risks and therefore will not understand that they need this coverage. I tend to trust consumers to make their own decision about how they want to spend their hard earned dollars provided they have been given sufficient data and a chance to think.
Sincerely,
Diane Cipa
Friday, July 03, 2009
We're having some phone issues.
Verizon will be out on Monday. If you call and can't hear us, please call back. ;)
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